From: Dan Kettler <dan@psicounsel.com>
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.astrology
Subject: Ed Wollmann alleged cancellations NCAT <was> Re: Proven
"terrorism"
definitions NCAT Net Censorship and Terrorism
Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 15:32:06 -0800
Message-ID: <3852DEF6.734BFAA4@psicounsel.com>
<snip>
Matt Kriebel wrote:
> > > <snip> In July of 1997, he [Wollmann] issued a rash of over
50
> > > illegitimate third-party
cancels...
> > > BK: Prove it!
MK: http://www.smbtech.com/ed/edcancels.html
MK: He lost his aznet account over that activity.
BK: So you allege. Lost perhaps, but because of that?
Alleged cancels from the AZNET account were in July 1997.
AZNET writes the following to EHW in OCTOBER 1997:
After giving you every opportunity to
let
the controversial threads subside, I
am
resigned to the fact that you are and
will
always be abrasive....
Edmond H. Wollmann (EHW) was dismissed from AZNET [an Internet Service
Provider (ISP)]
allegedly for being "abrasive" in October, but nothing about cancels
in July. If Matt Kriebel were
correct, then EHW would have lost his account in July, not October.
******************************************
http://www.astroconsulting.com/FAQs/jack_bailey.htm
******************************************
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 07:10:04
To: Jack Bailey <jjb@zNET.com>
From: Edmond Wollmann <wollmann@mail.sdsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Account
<snip>
>>We're all very tired of getting and answering
complaints
about you.
>> <snip> stop responding to criticism in
>>newsgroups, and to stop fanning the flames...
EHW: Why must I not respond to criticism?
<snip>
EHW: Why would you want to censor me?
From: "Nidiffer" <shebunker@usa.net>
Date: Wed, Oct 29, 1997 20:05 EST
<snip>
>>> Edmond, you have forced me to complain
to your isp
about posting this list over and over again. <snip>
EHW: You are letting disingenuous liars convince you that
I am the
problem they are obnoxious to me left and
right...<snip>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
EHW: So here after he cancels my account
(for something
someone else posted) I bring up his comments that
prove he is bigoted against astrology;
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 18:19:50
To: Jack Bailey <jjb@zNET.com>
From: Edmond Wollmann <wollmann@mail.sdsu.edu>
<snip>
EHW: If you had one ounce of integrity you would see that right
in this
persons message ID is the name skepticult - this is
the group
that has targeted me and complained repeatedly
for ANYTHING.
DK comment: What is the Skepticult organization?
http://www.psicounsel.com/skeporg.html
A group of bigots, censors, and terrorists.
<snip>
*************************************************************************************
END OF QUOTES FROM WOLLMANN SITE. Note, not one word about
his account
being cut off because of WOLLMANN CANCELLING POSTS. Here is another
example
of CENSORING BIGOTS, and what they do on the INTERNET. Thank
you for
having me dig this up, Matt Kriebel.
*************************************************************************************
The following can be verified in the DEJANEWS archives by clicking here.
From: gothic@netaxs.com (Matt Kriebel)
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.astrology
Subject: Re: Ed Wollmann alleged cancellations NCAT <was>
Re: Proven "terrorism" definitions NCAT Net
Censorship and Terrorism
Date: Sat, 11 Dec 1999 20:00:18 -0500
Message-ID: <gothic-1112992000180001@ppp45.blackbox1-mfs.netaxs.com>
In article <3852DEF6.734BFAA4@psicounsel.com>, dan@psicounsel.com
wrote:
<snip>
I have made a mistake here in alledging that Wollmann lost his aznet
account solely due to his canceling of posts... <snip>
... Kettler: Even if Wollmann didn't cancel messages...
<snip irrelevancy>
BK: Note the doubt expressed by Matt Kriebel regarding
alleged cancelled posts
by EHW.
> BK: That is _not_ proof, and you know it. People ask me,
> .... all the time to prove the cancels that are written
> .... about on this web page.
>
> BK: Web pages do not prove cancels. In fact, it's
> .... difficult to impossible to prove who cancels
> .... certain posts.
Even though the cancels alleged on my web page are not
yet conclusively proven, there is proof of many of the
other items (13 total) I have documented
links (proofs)
of.
> > > BK: Prove it. I showed on my web pages an alleged
cancel from
> > > Wollmann, in the "other.html"
page. The cancel was shown to be
> > > a forgery, to blame Wollmann for
it.
> MK: There are *fifty* headers
> MK: showing Wollman to have cancelled messages...
> Headers do not prove, either. First, there's the AZNET domain,
> which houses a number of members. Then, "AZNET" can be forged.
> You have been on the net a long time, and you know this.
BK: A message-ID can be forged. It's possible to hack... <snip>
> At the following site...
>
>
http://www.psicounsel.com/cancel.html
>
> ...just from the posts of ADMINS about numerous cancels,
> with my exchange about those cancels, one can readily see
> that ADMINS have a hard time knowing who is cancelling
> posts when the message IDs are not correct.
Let's look at some of these posts allegedly cancelled by Wollmann.
*********************************************************************
Subject: cmsg cancel <ea5_9707050943@ronly.org>
From: Edmond Wollmann <wollmann@aznet.net>
Date: 1997/07/13
Message-ID: <33C91597.2384@aznet.net>
Newsgroups:
alt.conspiracy,
alt.conspiracy.abe-lincoln,
alt.conspiracy.area51,
alt.conspiracy.digitalnation,
alt.conspiracy.jfk,
alt.conspiracy.netcom,
alt.conspiracy.nhs,
alt.conspiracy.spy,
alt.conspiracy.usenet-cabal,
alt.conspiracy.yak.worshippers,
alt.music.whit
**********************************************************************************
DK:
Are you going to tell me Wollmann cares about posts in the above newsgroups?
His concern is
astrology, primarily.
**********************************************************************************
Subject: cmsg cancel <abbaclone.200.0365A58D@hotmail.com>
From: Edmond Wollmann <wollmann@aznet.net>
Date: 1997/07/16
Message-ID: <33CD46CC.5A17@aznet.net>
Newsgroups:
alt.consciousness.4th-way
alt.fan.art-bell
alt.religion.roy-masters
alt.illuminati
************************************************************************
BK:
When has EHW complained about posts in the above newsgroups, without
an
astrology NG crosspost?
************************************************************************
BK:
No, these are "rogue" cancels, and EHW is the likely scapegoat
identification placed. He's an easy target for rogue cancellers,
because he posts so much in NEWS ADMIN NET-ABUSE USENET
(NANAU).
**********************************************************************************
Subject: cmsg cancel <94c_9707050513@ronly.org>
From: Edmond Wollmann <wollmann@aznet.net>
Date: 1997/07/13
Message-ID: <33C9167D.2565@aznet.net>
Newsgroups:
alt.sex.phone, alt.sex.pictures, alt.sex.pictures.female,
alt.sex,alt.sex, alt.sex.anal, alt.sex.services, alt.sex.pictures,
alt.binaries.pictures.erotica, alt.binaries.pict
************************************************************************************
BK:
Forgeries allegedly from EHW once were abundant in the USENET archives
(until EHW cancelled
them). The above, alleged, cancel of EHW is ridiculous.
The above newsgroups are typical targets
of "rogue" cancellers. To assume EHW would cancel posts to the
above newsgroups is ridiculous.
EHW has written quite a few times about other alleged posts from himself,
that they were forgeries,
and it was quite apparent upon careful examination that they were
forgeries.
************************************************************************************
People writing to USENET that alleged EHW posts are all really from
him
are naive, or blatant liars. I don't know how many of those on
the
Wollmann defamation site are forgeries.
Just today I read a quoted post from the site that people PARROT
from.
It was out of context. I answered that all one had to do was
read
my site,
and see that the quote, in context, showed no violent threats from
EHW.
--
dan (at) psicounsel com
www psicounsel com / news
From: Dan Kettler <dan@psicounsel.com>
Newsgroups: alt.paranormal,alt.astrology
Subject: Proven "terrorism" definitions NCAT Net
Censorship and Terrorism
Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 08:16:06 GMT
Message-ID: <82qcs5$emu$1@nnrp1.deja.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.175.101.51
<snip>
BK comment: A number of forgeries have appeared
in the newsgroups, posts allegedly from
EHW. That casts some doubt regarding
the quotes shown, which follow
MK: ...poor innocent Wollmann, victim of
terrorism (snort)
After all, Wollman
never said...
"Remove your defamation or I'll walk
down there and yank it off" _wollman_
BK: Many statements of EHW have been called threats
of physical violence, but when
taken in context
show entirely different.
I have a quote on my web
site from PSF, which when magnified
show it did
not mean what had been alleged.
Other alleged statements of EHW never were
said,
since there have been so many forgeries in
the
Newsgroups.
EHW: ...kick the f**k out of you, talk like
this-AND
STILL post something of value"
MK: Say that sounds kinda threatin...
BK: Actually, not threatening. However, the quotes from
certain PSF linked from
the above referenced Web
page are definately threatening.
The only threatening
thing about EHW, actually,
to the PSF is that he *does*
post valuable information,
he is intelligent, and he
writes about astrology credibly.
He kicks a*s in debates all the time. That's threatening.
Another thing is that he will not
let you people take over
the Internet, with him lying down, while you
walk all over
every proponent who is demanding, and others
who will
demand the freedom they are entitled to.
EHW: "I will STAY and send 100,000 complaints
to every insitution
(sic) on the planet
and more if
action is not taken."
BK: If a policeman threatens a criminal with a gun, to cease
his criminal act, that is
not wrong. The wrong act is
of the criminal. The person
threatening to defend themself
has that right. If EHW threatens
100,000 complaints, and
if the complaints are legitimate,
as I see they actually are,
then what's the problem?
MK: Hmmm sounds kind of like blackmail there...
BK: Nope
EHW: "I WILL GO IN PERSON AND TAKE ALL LEGAL, ETHICAL,
AND MATERIAL ACTION I CAN"
MK: Whao! harsh out Wollman!
BK: You seem to have problems with rational interpretation,
and rational thought,
or telling the truth.
MK quoting EHW: "8000 complaints lined up."
MK: Don't worry, Kettler still likes you.
BK: Sarcasm, from you, says nothing rational.
EHW: ...complaints to all state agencies sent for
stalking
an harassment."
BK: And, are you saying, PSF don't stalk and
harass?
Since this is
their habit, and has been for decades,
what's wrong
with a million complaints?
BK: Wow, threatening people with a gov't agency.
Nothig came
of this, aren't there laws about
that?
BK: I will threaten anyone with a government agency if
the person is breaking the
law in their actions against
me. No-one can rightly
fault me, or call me a censor,
or terrorist for that.
EHW allegedly: "Complaints for threatening violence
and abuse sent to
FBI. "
BK: Did he write that, or any of the other things I quote, here
from you? I know of some
of it, but I'm not sure of all
that you quote.
Still, it does not prove anything, what you quote.
MK: Well. lots of efforts at intimidation and blackmail...
BK: You deny that PSEUDO-SKEPTIC-FANATICS
are the TERRORISTS,
and PROPONENTS LIKE
WOLLMANN ARE DEFENDING
THEMSELVES.
--
dan (at) psicounsel com
www psicounsel com / news